The Idea of Scoring

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The Idea of Scoring

Postby weasel on Tue Aug 26, 2008 1:33 pm

I'm just wondering what you guys, our gaming public, think of "scoring."

Personally, I'm torn on the issue.

On one hand, I like that the game for it's simplicity - and the community atmosphere that is more about helping each other out than just beating the guy next to you. Adding scoring is useless in terms of gameplay and just adds unnecessary amounts of drama to the community. Plus there will end up being 'ultimate designs' - whoever gets to the top of the list first gets to stay there forever. Not sure how much I like that.

On the other hand, I love getting my name in a high score list. :xd:

So, do you want scoring? If so, how would you like things scored (generally speaking)? If not, why not?

(If I did implement score I think it would be something like ... weighted score values on each different type of part, multiplied by ticks until victory. The lower the number the better you do.)
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby NightStryke on Tue Aug 26, 2008 1:40 pm

I'd love to have some sort of official scoring mechanism. I can't speak for everyone else, but I'm already competitive to a degree, so having designs scored would only give me a better measure of mine and others' contraptions. I think that those who are competitive are competitive regardless of whether or not there's an official score on their contraption, so adding it wouldn't suddenly make everyone competitive.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby weasel on Tue Aug 26, 2008 1:44 pm

I think a big problem with scoring in a game this simple is that the top ten list will be quickly established, and only a few fluke tweaks will make anyone beat it any faster. The result won't really be competition - it'll be people fighting over whether they can be #50 or #49 and it might be a little demoralizing.

I think score WOULD play an excellent role in the multiplayer threads though. :)
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby OfficiallyHaphazard on Tue Aug 26, 2008 2:08 pm

I personally don't like the idea of an official score. Having the raw data (time, number of pieces) easily accessible would be good, but actually having a calculated score would take the fun out of making "cool" contraptions, in my opinion. Let people in the threads figure out how much to weight each part of the score, but when you say "this is how many points your machine got" then some people can say "my machine is better than yours!" which takes away from the casual fun.

Right now beating the level is a reward enough and you can easily view other people's contraptions, which is enough to gauge how well one did... but I think displaying the score would be demoralizing.

Furthermore, there is no way to take into account cool things such as Champions or boomerangs...
If you decide to put in a score, I would suggest to bury it inside of a "Statistics" menu item, so it doesn't become a fixture of this game.


Anyhow, those are my two cents. :)
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby weasel on Tue Aug 26, 2008 2:16 pm

Hmm, yes, good point. I think I could show on the victory screen the ticks, and then people could use that to generate their own scores. Heck, I'll bet that sk98q dude could make a custom score multiplier in his database, since he already counts up the parts automatically.

The game is about flexibility and options; the more I think about it the less locking in an "official score" the worse it sounds.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby Argax on Tue Aug 26, 2008 2:23 pm

weasel wrote:Hmm, yes, good point. I think I could show on the victory screen the ticks, and then people could use that to generate their own scores. Heck, I'll bet that sk98q dude could make a custom score multiplier in his database, since he already counts up the parts automatically.

The game is about flexibility and options; the more I think about it the less locking in an "official score" the worse it sounds.


Yes, I agree raw numbers (for duration and pieces) would be just as perfect and we can interpret them as we please :)
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby blurg on Tue Aug 26, 2008 2:29 pm

Scoring is nice, and I'm as competitive as the next guy, but there are elements of this game which you can't slap a score on. There's ingenuity, complexity (not just number of parts), and style. I won't believe that just because someone uses one less stick than me that their design is automatically better. Unless someone shows me the formula for cool-factor, I'm happier with the current scoring method - I score everything myself in my head, the only place that matters.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby GaMatecal on Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:57 am

Hello, I am new... unpaid member :p

You also have to take into account the re playability of each level. After I've done the levels, I felt I have completed the 'game'. I'm not saying to have a high scores though. I'm thinking more of a personal score (account specific), so you can replay the game and try to beat it. Adds an extra layer to the game. How the scoring is done... well, I don't think it should be by number of pieces used, but the badges that I've heard about while reading through the forum. Implementing those to automatically check to see if you achieved this goal.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby Yllnath on Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:43 am

I agree, I would rather see stuff like the badges be officially be implemented for each player, for each level you've played.
Also, I think adding time and piece count is much better. There could be bragging between who has the lowest piece count or bragging between who is faster, but like Blurg said, you can't put a price on the coolness factor. I have more fun watching some weird but awesome contraption than a one-stick solution, even though the one stick will most likely score better.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby SSH on Wed Aug 27, 2008 4:12 am

So, the scores would be lowest best, like the pricing in Armadillo Run?
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby thax on Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:37 am

It would be nice to have multiple categories.

Fewest Pieces
Fastest Solution
Cleanest Design
Parked
Fewest Power Wheels

Any scoring system should give points for the above.

The main problem comes from the physics glitches which will solve most problems the fastest.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby id7VH on Wed Aug 27, 2008 9:49 pm

If you do implement a scoring system, one way to score 'coolness' is obvious: make the rating part of the score. This way, there is always a chance to become number one. Of course, the number one spot will obviously get the most views, inflating its rating easier. But, the more people that like it, the more it genuinely deserves the top spot.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby Guest on Thu Aug 28, 2008 5:06 am

i was just thinking about it too and how I think it would ruin the game if there was a method of scoring. The problem is that the method must be biased in one way or another personally I don't care nearly as much about using he fewest number of pieces. I would not like the collective focus to be on a beating a score.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby DrizztFan24 on Thu Aug 28, 2008 7:41 am

What if the scoring system were used in a challenge mode? like once per week a user made level is put up to be beaten, the community challenges to beat the level, Then either an automatic scoring system or a team can score the contraptions. You can have points for just plain awesomnocity or points for going green or such. I would suggest the panel of judges personally.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby 6ft9man on Thu Aug 28, 2008 11:25 am

An "official" scoring would be a bad idea, imho. Giving raw data would be better, such as possibly total weight of a contraption, size of parts, etc. Even official badges being used are just as bad an idea simply because you can watch one person's entry, save it as your own and get a badge you didn't earn.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby Dataman on Thu Aug 28, 2008 3:52 pm

I think there is no way to give a 'best' score and therefore you shouldn't try. There's just too many factors involved.

I would like to see a badge of some kind to show I've completed a level and maybe some basic stats such as the number of pieces used and time (ticks) taken.

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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby macklin on Thu Aug 28, 2008 10:53 pm

I am a student of economics, a product of sales and marketing, and an avid fan of architecture and engineering. Almost eveything ever considered has to do with cost and deadlines.

If cost and time are not apart of the system it seems artificial and contrived.

So a scoring system which rewards efficient design and timely completion is very satisfying for my mind.

I really want a scoring system that sort of accounts for each piece in a cost manner and can time performance.

In our society it is not just effectiveness that counts, it is effectiveness along with efficiency and timely completion. Because this it the basis of economics, this is really something my mind desires to figure out.

There was a great articule on helium once that spoke to this, I'll try to find it....

http://www.helium.com/items/311722-mana ... efficiency
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby C4FF on Fri Aug 29, 2008 9:27 am

Scoring could be good, but to make it fair it would need to be split up into sections of scoring. i.e.:

Overall scoring:

1 - Water Rod
2 - Solid Rod
3 - Unpowered Wheel
4 - Powered Wheel

Within this we have the sections:

- 10 Boomerang
- 10 Clean
- 5 Champ
- 10 Brown
- 10 Green

and then all of these need to be multiples, like when you score you have check boxes for brown + champ (- 15) etc.

Also to make it completely fair, when two contraptions score the same for champ for example, There could be a public polling system to choose the first place guy.

i.e. person 1 gets 10 votes, person 2 gets 5 votes, person 1 is on top. then after a while person 2 has 11 votes and then becomes #1.

So as you can see it all gets pretty complicated, but hey.. thats why we have the challenge section right?
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby thax on Fri Aug 29, 2008 11:36 am

It is also critically important to have date / time stamps so that people can see if someone copied another design, or who was first to come up with a particular solution.

Date Saved / Modified
Date Published

It is important to have both time stamps because someone may come up with a solution first but publish a design at a later date. If they do so and someone has a similar design already published you can see that they did not copy the design.
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Re: The Idea of Scoring

Postby OfficiallyHaphazard on Fri Aug 29, 2008 11:40 am

Another idea: weasel must go through every entry and score it by hand :xd:
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